Never Take A Deposit: 9x12 Postcard Sales Rules From A 40-Year Sales Veteran

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Morning everybody. How's it going people? >> Good morning. It's going fine. Ben, how are you?

>> Good. How are you doing? >> Well, I can report one win for this week. I got my first double ad done. >> Hey, congratulations.

>> Thank you. >> That's exciting. It >> is. I've reached out to a few people. I haven't done much because with my business, there's always something pulling me away.

But I finally got to it and got a yes and got a payment. So that's good. >> Awesome. That is outstanding. >> I'm trying to move mine along as well.

>> I've got two campaigns going in two different zip codes and I'm going to do 5,000 postcards twice to each one on the 6 and 1 half x 12 inch cards. I have a insurance guy on both of them that bought a double spot and so I'm trying to work on some other things lately, but I've been trying to get back to it and trying to get that moving forward again. So, I've been sending emails and trying to reach out to people and trying to get some interest and getting a little bit of interest, but just like all of us, I need to do more. >> Well, that's good. Running too at the same time.

That's Well, you've been in it for a while, right? >> Well, since January, so I'm still a newbie. I uh have successfully gotten out four separate cards. Um so, you know, well, but uh I still consider myself a a newbie on this. Um but the uh the guy um wanted to do both campaigns cuz his insurance office is like right on border of the two zip codes.

So >> Oh, that's perfect. >> Yeah, I'm start two new campaigns for you. How's everybody else doing? >> Living the dreams. >> And hopefully not a nightmare.

>> There are times when it goes back and forth. >> Yeah, >> the um >> that's good. curious. You're are you doing uh this the smaller cards or the 9 by12s for your your uh >> community cards right now? >> Okay.

Yeah. >> I want to get into the 9 by12s. I just haven't yet. >> I am in the uh earlyish stages of my second uh 9 by12 campaign going out to the same uh area. And I'm noting that uh the the the paste for many of the advertisers to renew for backtoback months.

You know, you don't skip a month, come back and see me. that kind of a thing, which I understand that's not a tiny sum of money, but uh I also try to encourage them that repetition is where they're going to get the benefit out of this because it's being seen more than just once. So, there's a to deal with. Yeah. >> And you know, of large numbers, you know, 5,000 is better than 2500.

You know, more expensive for sure, but you know, you're net out there way more times. It increases the amount of times that you'll have opportunities to get clients from that. And >> yeah, >> that's what I've been trying to educate people on. And some some people get it and you know roofing guy that I was talking to that you know trailer before and it you know it's like well tell me more about that. like how did you send out?

How how where did you send them? Uh you only sent a small amount like 500. You know that is five people. And if you happen to actually get five, is that because you're actually getting 1% or is it just total randomness? You know, >> but if you multiply that by 10 to 5,000, then you're increasing your odds much more.

Well, it's fascinating to me the I don't know about in your neck of the woods, but here where I am, u billboards have become have come sort of come as a fashionable way of advertising. And they're expensive. They're not depending on where it's located and such. You as an advertiser, you could easily be looking at probably $500 to $1,000 a month for the positioning. And that's not including the initial setup for the the artwork and all the rest of that.

>> And it's a it's such a random thing. I get where if you're dealing with traffic that's going back and forth every day and seeing the same thing and over and over, you're going to get some repetition benefit, but by and large, people are not stopping their car and like looking and taking pictures of people's billboards to remember who the advertiser is. So, it's it's an interesting comp because uh from a cost uh the cost of the the 9x12 versus the billboard, the 9x12 is still a better value. I mean, lowly opinion and the fact that it can sit there on somebody's refrigerator or countertop or or whatever or it can be handed to somebody else trumps a billboard any day of the week. And I'm not saying billboards don't have their own benefit, but >> right, >> you got battles.

You know, we're going to we're going to go >> Oh, yeah. And I mean, cards are much more likely to stick around in people's houses because they may not need one particular service right away, but they might need another. And so, you know, looking back at the QR code tracker and I just saw last week there were two separate scans of a card that I sent out either in May or late June. >> Mhm. And so, you know, let's it was the one in late June, you know, Slater, you know, scanning the card and uh I think that that was my actual ad for my uh knife services, >> so people do hang on to them.

I haven't gotten any calls, but that's okay. >> Well, the there's a high probability you will at some point. I mean, they're scanning that there's a good chance that they will reach out to you directly or they may refer you to someone who who have need of your services for sure, >> right? >> Yeah. >> Well, with the uh virtual card, that allows opportunities to go even farther now.

Yeah. >> Um [clears throat] I've been trying to push it like I I've the uh virtual card on my Facebook pages and uh tried to encourage my advertisers to share the card as well. And I don't think they did. [laughter] Like come on guys. You know how we make it good for everybody?

Everyone has to participate and uh everybody's just busy. I I try to be really good at communicating and sending out update emails to everybody to let everyone know, hey, I just ordered the cards. Hey, I just received the cards. >> Uh they're all ready to go to the post office. >> And then another email, hey, I went to the post office just to, you know, trust there.

And um one was like you're sending two or it was trying to get approvals of like a a more final, you know, more final look at your ad, make sure it's right. And this lady, she's a a publisher, so she's a editor big time. And she's like, "You're sending too many emails. Just send it." And of course, there were spelling mistakes and grammar errors in her email back to me.

Well, I took another look at her ad. Her phone number was wrong. So, it's always worth taking another look. I'm like, aren't you glad that I emailed you that you wrote back to me? What's everybody else got going on in terms of their efforts and results?

>> So, I'll come forward with my Miapa. I've been doing a lot of dropins. I'm simultaneously doing card number three and card number four. They're both 9 by12s, whereas one and two were the 6 by11s. And I'm looking for feedback from the group and see what you guys think.

So, first of all, on the six um community card versus the 9 by12, that community card is such an easy sale because you know the point if I'm dropping 5,000, I'm charging 249 bucks for it in my small town. Um still making a couple thousand in profit obviously. And then going to the 9 by12, I'm doing 10,000 at a time. I've got two nice affluent areas that I'm doing and I'm charging 777 for a spot. So that's, you know, each and I mostly get zero price resistance, but the folks that are not taking it, they're not giving me a price objection.

They're acting like they have all the business they need. But I'm wondering if it really is a price objection. So first thing I'm wondering from the group is are you seeing price as an obstacle? I mean, ridiculous to do these for five or seven or eight cents each. Uh, I know people in, you know, southern Indiana, by the way, for context.

So, I'm in like the area and the nice suburbs on the Indiana side. Um, the thing that I got called out for last week is I was doing a drop in and it totally floored me. I've been a professional salesperson since I'm 16. I do sales training. I've been through Sandler training and NLP neural linguistic programming.

So, um, I very polished. So this guy after I gave my spiel, he says, "Sounds Oh, I should mention that um when I'm going to people, I'm saying,"Hey, my name is Lucy and I own a plant nursery. I'm a fellow business owner like you. I sell edible, medicinal, and culinary plants. Here's my card.

Here's my ad, you know, in their hand." So they've got some social proof. And then I'm looking to expand my business. Didn't have a lot of money for advertising. So I got the idea, why don't I just, you know, giant postcard.

we'll all split the cost and we'll be able to get some great advertising right in people's hands. The guy looks at me and he said, "It sounds to me like you're a postcard salesperson, not a plant nursery owner." And I was like, "Man, you got me. I've been a professional salesperson for, you know, 40 years. So, I I I'm polished."

And then that led to the conversation where I shared with him um the other things that he might know me for in the community. And I got to go do another drop in. I I did email followup with my template email. But I'm just wondering, have you guys like tried both ways? Today I'm doing dropins and I'm gonna play dumb.

I'm just gonna act like I don't know what the heck I'm doing and definitely not be polished. So just out there for the what are you seeing on pricing and then what are you seeing on, you know, has wonderful 62 second pitch versus stumbling around and acting not confident. >> I think your pitch was great. I think it sounded really good and you know say having your own actual business that you're doing something is huge and yeah we are postcard salesman but that's okay there's nothing wrong with that because we're still providing a value and a benefit for them you know making money sure but they could go organize a postcard and make money and they're not getting their information out there and so uh if if you're able to give an idea of you know many customers that you serve just to show that you know you are legitimately doing it not just oh I sold one and that was it but if you're able to show something like that that's good but even outside of that you know if you're a postcard salesman yeah I am but I'm trying to grow my business too this is the best way for me to help advertise my business and I can't afford to do a a solo postcard. It's too expensive.

So, let's all get in on this together as a team. And uh that's two cents. >> That is a great response. I'm totally going to rip off half of that. And and got me and I said, "Honestly, man, I'm trying to grow this this nursery um because put it on my heart to help people get food in their yards and do permaculture food force and stuff.

If I'm six grand to drop on a 9 by12 mailer where I could put all of my stuff and big pictures of what I'm selling on there, I would because it'd be more effective for me to have that much space. But right now, I'm at the point in my business where it makes more sense for me to share some space with you and give us both a good deal. But it just I have to be careful because I sound too polished and too rehearsed. And to have somebody actually have the confidence to call me out on that and say those words out loud just floored me. Lucy, um, I relate to what you're saying and you mentioned I I had a six-year training relationship with Sandler.

I'm I'm a trainer facilitator for Sandler training and I've been in sales for >> you know then you know many upfront contracts all day long. >> The uh I I have been doing u literal just door to door to door but I I targets ahead of time. So, if I'm going to do drop in or if I'm going to do cold call, if you will, I already have done a little bit of research on the business ahead of time to know if they're a viable prospect. And nine times out of 10, I know the name of the business owner before I walk in the door. So, I I immediately ask for that person if if they are.

And if they're not, that's fine. I'll say say, "Well, and I I have a card. I do business consulting in the area." And I'll I'll hand them the card. I'll say, "Doug," I said, "There's something real quick I wanted to talk to you about, assuming I'm talking to that person."

and and I said, "I have no idea at this point if you're interested in increasing your business or not, but I want to show something." And I pull out the card. I have it in a little like a vanilla folder and I say this and I show it to them and their their reaction is typically like, "What the heck is that?" They don't say it, but you can tell based on body language and eyes and all that that this gets their attention. And I said, >> "Yeah, I've never ever seen anything like this before."

Nine times out of 10, they have no idea what it is. And that's the door, the opening to to a little bit of a a description of the vehicle, what it is, how it can improve their business. And I always back off again. I always do the takeaway. I say again, I have no idea if this is something you're even looking to do with your business, but this is a a male opportunity that can actually get your name in front of 5,000 area high, you know, people that might be predisposed to spend money on your business.

Is there anything you'd like to talk about? And >> oh, I love that, you know, for sharing that and and your Sandler because you saying that reminds me that I'm just talking way too much. I'm making it easy on them. I'm [laughter] doing more than six. If I'm going through my head through the ones that I did the last couple of days, I'm talking too much.

I'm not asking enough questions. >> And I think you just gave me a key, which is just hand it to them and shut up and let them start asking me questions. >> The and I advised this to to Mitch last week. We did a an interview which I guess is going to be probably posted here next week if I'm not mistaken. But but the card does the talking for the most part.

I mean I used the community card yet. So I mean but I I think the 9 by12 is really it's kind of people see it and they're like what the heck is that? And it's you know it's hard it's heavy card stock. You can show it. You can reflect the light off it.

All those fun things that gets people's attention. And from there you've got an opportunity to open up a discussion. But it it comes back to asking questions to find out, you know, even looking to grow their business. Maybe not. This may not be a fit for you.

I always do the takeaway because I want them know then they're looking I don't need their business. I mean, their business, but I'm not looking to, you know, grab them by the arm and put it behind their back and talk them into something. Either it makes sense or it doesn't. >> That's kind of a good point to mention to them, a good little statement. you know, I'm not sure if this will be a good fit for you cuz it gets them thinking, wait, why wouldn't it not be a good fit for me?

>> Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. It's there's those who are not familiar with Sandler. This is kind of a principles of Sandler.

It's like the the delay or some version of look at the upfront contract. Hey, we may talk for a minute or two and realize that this is not something you're going to need or I may realize I can't help you. [clears throat] That's okay. Please free to say so because most sales people, especially if they're direct sales, they walk in and they just lay a big wrap on them right out of the gate and talk talk. That's what makes gives sales people unfortunately a bad name.

Don't be that person. >> It's the hardest thing not to do and so important to be quiet and to ask the questions. And I struggle with that so much. Like >> helping her name is uh Elena. she was helping her with a pest control client that she had that wanted to do um a sailor and uh poor was really struggling and and had no idea and I'm like just ask them cuz then the person start want to do like a tail and I'm like that's going to be way more expensive you know EDM is going to be a much much fit and I told her just slow down step all the way back and just be like I'm really sorry I should ask this beginning.

What's your budget? You know, basic questions. It's the hardest thing to do, but it's so important. >> A a very valuable lesson I learned a long time ago, and Lucy, you probably heard some version of this yourself. The person asking the questions is controlling the conversation.

>> Yeah. >> If you all the talking, you're not really in control of the conversation. But if you're letting them talk and you're asking questions and you're guiding it, you're the one controlling the discussion and that's where you want to be. And it may not result in the sale either. That's that's a given.

That's naturally a part of the process. It's like sorting these people, you know, prospect or not a prospect. But um to be from my experience, direct experience tends to be a better way to to move it. And I I'm doing the research. It takes a little more time up front than just going door to door to do it.

I mean, expensive product and I I don't just walk in businesses that don't necessarily have a product that if they sell 20 of them, they're not going to be able to pay the thing off. I want businesses that are probably, you know, reasonably expensive service product service that they can sell two or three of them and they've already paid their investment. >> Thank you for coming today, Dick. >> My two cents or or five cents, take your pick. Yeah.

Who's I'm asking >> group at large here because I didn't use uh Facebook at I didn't do groups. I didn't do anything for the first card. I went out literally as I just described. I had relationships with people. I went out and called on them in some fashion.

But I'm now for the second card using uh local groups for this. But who's been using groups and what's been their best approach to get the interest of people on on the groups to respond? Anybody got anything they could offer? >> I've just used exactly what Mitchell has. So, um, full disclosure, I'm 55 and so I'm at that age group where I, you know, some computers but didn't grow up with social media like my own children have.

And so, um, although I'm a Facebook addict, it was the idea of going into groups and almost soliciting, it made me very hesitant to do so. So, I was like, I don't even know what to tell these people on DMs and whatever. So, I literally just copied and pasted out of what Mitchell has in the group >> and put that back in the classroom and it worked. Um, I'm the only thing that I'm not going to say it didn't work, but the only thing that I would have liked better is when I put that out there in the groups, I seem to get a lot of cottage industry um, you know, selling candles and most of them, you know, themselves. And so, what I did is I picked up this is the template that I'm using and showing people.

So, I've got this and I call this the realtor spot because I sold it to a realtor for 1,400 bucks. And then I've got these spots and I decided that these would be my cottage industry spots. So I'm selling these for 299. And this is on a 10,000 run. So I've got a pooper scooper and a massage lady and a pressure washer and a lady that does goat milk soap.

So I'm calling it my cottage industry thing. Um and I don't want to fill up the cart with a whole bunch of these and just, you know, really visually distracting. But out of the Facebook groups, most of the ones that I'm getting, people are tagging themselves and their friends, and they're all pretty small businesses. If they're home services, they're usually Chuck and a truck. >> You know, maybe Chuck and his kid and a truck.

>> So, if the problem that I'd like to solve is getting to, like you said, somebody do one, two, three transactions and it more than pays for it. >> Yeah. Well, when I post when I did this just like about a week ago, I start there are three three sizable groups here in in live in Connecticut that are for the town, you know, live here and all that. And I I did the same post and all three. And I took I I had images of the front and back of the card, front and back, whichever whichever wish.

And I put them up and I gave a little bit of a description of what it was and the fact that these, you know, these advertisers, if you you seek them out, I just gave them a little bit of plug even though they were on the card. And uh I had a decent amount of outreach. In fact, I'm signing up an electrician for the next card as a result of that posted in one of those groups, but I' I'd be a little bit more um effective standpoint of the investment of time and such. And I'm actually now thinking about doing a video video and holding the card because the pictures don't really again it's the same thing when you walk into a business. When you've got the card physically, you can hand them.

It's an entirely different impact than just showing them a picture of it. So the video would be like here it is and showing both sides and kind of so they can see the the card stock and all that. And I'm just about that as as the next wave in the the group posting. But I just wondered if anybody else is doing anything unique different along those lines. >> I tried recently a couple of times in the last few weeks and I didn't have any success.

Um, I see uh from time in my city some people doing it every once in a great while I see a lot more people or in Denver doing it. I'm in Colorado Springs and so once in a while I'll see somebody doing it and just in case that they do like there's where like I don't just want to be a postcard salesman, you know, to try and stand out a little bit and kind of and uh also things that we're able to offer that other providers aren't like the virtual postcard and uh Um, I'm my post's kind of a little bit different. Uh, but didn't have any luck the last couple of times I went fishing. But, uh, that's >> Well, it seems like there's a the for I'm almost going to say like a warning because I've noted in some instances where somebody will post in the group, I'm looking for a a roofer, for example. And of course, everybody will jump out and recommend their person.

Some of them I'm I'm aware of, others I'm not. But that seems like an opportunity to reach out to the recommended vendors and say, "Hey, I noticed you're come up. I'm new to the group and all that. What are you doing?" I mean, you conversation like, "What are you doing to promote your business?

I may have a vehicle for you and so on and so forth." And it's not a cold cold. I'm saying >> those are the things that I would rather spend more time on is reaching out to those businesses directly and individually than doing the group stuff, which the group stuff doesn't take much time, but you know, also protect my knife sharpening services, too. And so, I'm trying to stay in a a good light and not having to deal with trolls being like, "This is a scam. Nobody should ever do this."

And uh I just don't want to deal with that crap. So yeah, I'm more likely to uh and I did with electrician. Electrician posted on Facebook yesterday and I reached out to him directly and he did respond. I haven't heard from him since, but just another technique. >> Yeah.

Who else else? Got another observers here. Come on, let's go. Don't be shy. Let's say somebody else say something.

Mueller. Mueller. >> Yeah. Well, I I don't much else. There we go.

Hey sir, >> I'm new to the group. >> Wonderful. Welcome. >> Thanks. I've been trying to do some version of a card now for a couple weeks and I realized I've been shooting myself in the foot a little bit cuz I was targeting too big of an area.

Um, and then like I had too many businesses that were opportunities and like, oh, we're sending it to well, a little bit over here and a little bit over there, you know, spreading it out, but like with people like I think that was a very big selling point. So, I changed this past week. I'm like, I'm going to pick one area and I'm like only going to target businesses right there and I'm only going to send it to people right there. Um, but for Facebook, that's where I've gotten Yeah. all of my uh leads are.

I've gotten four spots filled just by posting in groups like y'all were saying. Um, but I'm having the same problem of it being smaller ticket places. And so I'm still trying to figure out how to get people who can afford a full spot on a 9x12. So the Facebook thing does work, but I haven't found out how it works on a non-disounted way. trying to get myself out of discount land.

>> Steph, [snorts] something I just thought of here that actually I've been noodling on a little bit with respect to what you're just saying is um you could conceivably be proactive with with regards to asking for the types of businesses you want to have on the card. So you put out in the group, does anybody know any attorneys? Does anybody know any financial planners? I mean, I'm looking at this card looking for people, you know, of that ilk who are clearly, you know, learners and might have the budgets for those kinds of things. That way you're you're being specific of what you're looking for and and IR just because of the way these things seem to work.

Somebody's going to know someone. They're going to say, "Oh yeah, my whatever. Would you be willing to make an introduction?" Or you can reach out on the basis of that recommendation. Just a thought.

>> Great idea. Love that. Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Yeah.

All right. And I get your point. I mean, a couple of people reach out since I, you know, launched the groups in the groups I'm in and they're they said, "I'm interested." and I quickly looked at their business and researched. I didn't ignore them, but it became apparent kind of right gate that they're probably not in the the bracket that where they would necessarily do it, but I certainly followed up with them.

Uh, and you know, as a courtesy, you want to make sure you're not leaving anybody ignored. But, yeah, let's say for a $500 spot on a 9 by12, they got to be selling something that's going to be redeemed pretty quickly in terms of the price. >> Yeah, absolutely. Lucy or Ben, what what do you found to be some of your better advertising prospects? I mean, people have signed on to date for for things types of businesses.

>> Yeah. So, you know, great question. Um, what I have so far, I'm just going to kind of because I don't have them in front of me. >> This is my low tech social proof thing that I do. Um, same from a template pack.

And so I do the stars because you get gold stars, you know, do a good thing and you're in kindergarten. So, so I got to fill in a couple of these, but I actually got Big O tires. So these are franchises. So the tire guy and an area that I'm spanning actually has two different Big O Tires. And since they're franchises, when he hesitated, I said, "Man, it's no big deal.

I know there's another one over on Charlestown Road." He, you know, State Street. And I said, "It's cool, man. I'll just go talk to him." He's like, "No, I want those leads."

I'm like, "Okay." Um, let's see. I'll tell you what I've consistently gotten. This one is a doggy daycare grooming type thing where they do the obviously got to be pretty bougie and have some money for your dogs to go play. And my next card, which is this one, the only one that I've got filled I put a posty on, is also a dog doggy day.

So, don't sleep on the doggy daycarees. Those are some serious MRS. Um, then I got my tree service. Um, you know, ticket items. HVAC.

This is the realtor that did the the spot. Oh, this is my favorite place to eat. If you make it down to southern Indiana, got to go to Bayou Butcher Shop. They are from Louisiana. Came up here.

You don't even need teeth to eat their brisket. And so, they do a lunch plate. That's >> You don't need teeth as you say. >> That's what I tell people. And I don't know if brisket is bigger you are, but man, in Indiana [clears throat] is a contest.

So, we're we're all fighting for it, but um they are doing buy one get half price and they are super popular. They always sell out from 11 to 1. Um First Choice Health and Wellness, they are uh those alternative integrative hair care places. So, they've got chiropractor, physical therapists, massage therapists. They have the ability to, you know, offer a quick MRI.

So, oh my insurance agent. >> So, I've tried to stack up. I still need to get a mortgage broker in this spot, but my my spot here, I'm trying to get that integration of the realtor wanted her mortgage broker to do it, but she didn't have 777 bucks. And I'm not doing anybody I'm not doing any credit terms for anybody. You're not getting on my card unless I've got the cash.

So, those are the ones that I've tried to do on my little card. [clears throat] I can just read them off to you if I do it upside down. Ice cream place seasonal. Um, this is red, white, and blue because the local high school is red, white, and blue. This one, um, I'm do 10,000, but there are two different high schools in that area.

So 5,000. One of the high schools that my kids go to is green and yellow. And then the other high school is red, black, and white. So those cards, I'm going to split the ordering. They'll they'll have the exact same advertisers, but they'll have different uh different on.

So who else have I got? So even then my little tiny 5,000 run in a 7,000 person town, I've got the HBAC person. And I have multiple in this town. I have multiple food places. I really try and get at least half a dozen that are food.

Yesterday I tried to get um a new place that does like smoothies. They've got like the weight loss and everything and they're opening up three or four franchises in the you know towns that are all kind of here. I couldn't even get him to do a barter. I like you know did pitch went on to do the rest of the people in the strip mall. And then I came back I'm thinking dummy you didn't even think about bartering.

Why not? cuz the um I'm Ditchel's thing with the QR code and I'm going to use my QR code to be to build my email list and anybody that wants to barter with me. I'm going to get gift certificates and then um sign up to be entered into a drawing to get the gift certificate. So, I'm like, "Okay, perfect. Bucks.

I'll put them in a cottage spot and let me see if I can get, you know, gift certificates out of it." And they're like, "No, our budget is too small. You know, we're $45,000 to open up this franchise." And I don't know, Doug, maybe you would have had a better Sandler style comeback, but I you one thing that I I think of now is, you know, we issue these gift certificates. They're not going to all go out at once.

You're not going to have $300 worth of redemption come in. We're going to send these out one a week. I probably should have told them that I would um do a specific QR code. I don't know. I'm rambling right now because I just can't believe that I couldn't get them to barter with me.

I mean, how natural is it if you're opening up three different locations to have somebody that you know you have 12 gift certificates to that are going to go to customers, you're going to become recurring revenue. So, maybe they just didn't like me. Maybe I was just too pushy and polished thing. >> Yeah. It's just a terrible thing.

Yeah. >> Or maybe of some kind, you know, yet so they think they're automatically going to be successful and they don't yet have pain. I didn't tell them I didn't ask them if they were having a hard time. So, you know, Submarine, I'm like, >> I've been skipping right to the pitch, right to fulfillment. I didn't get them to tell me that they had pain.

I didn't get them to tell me that they were going to make a decision to do it, >> you know, right to the end and got lazy. So, guess that'll be my project today. >> Review, right? [laughter] Yeah. Yeah.

Throw this out just for for who's listening and thinking about this. One thing I found to be kind of effective, and I'm sure every every has some version of this. Uh, hold on. I'm going to see if I can get a copy of this thing. There's a See here.

Hold on. I should have had it handy. I downloaded I'm totally not prepared. Here we go. So, there is a Yeah.

a magazine, even though it's not. There's a magazine. It's called Direct Advantage and it's a mail and every month this comes out and it's it's, you know, 30 pages of advertisers, mostly home improvement, mostly predominantly home, roofers, landscapers, you name it. Occasionally you'll have a restaurant or a food service place or in this case there's a shoe store here that's advertising. But in those instances where you're, you know, something like that, um, I will tear out the page that the ad is on of the of the merchant or the business owner >> and will walk in and I'll say, "Who do I talk to about this?"

And I don't even necessarily introduce myself. I'll just say, "Who do I talk to about this?" Now, if the owner's there, the person who's responsible for the ad, they'll say me. I say, "Um, got a question for you about it. How's it working?"

And and I'll say, "Well, are you maybe open to seeing something that could be a little bit more effective?" Boom. Hold out the card. Just hold it right in front of them. >> Yeah.

Now, I mean, not just that. Now, here's You HVAC. So, I got this came in my my mail here. This, which you may be able to see, is from a local HVAC company here in town. two-sided like a 6 by8 or it's a you know a big card but they got that and I don't need HVAC and nine times out of 10 anybody who gets this who doesn't need that is going to throw it right in the waste basket as we all know but it gave me something to walk in the front door of the business with similar to the one I just showed you with the magazine say who do I talk to about this and then from there you open up into the conversation about the 9x12 and this this I don't know how many people this went out to but I guarantee you this costs way more than a $500 ad on a 9 by12 card going out to 5,000 people.

Way more. So, >> I I got my tree service because I hadn't seen one of these before, but um it was just heavyweight paper. It might have been 25 orb paper and had a little bit of texture to it and it was like um it was just a sales letter and it came as an EDDDM but it was you know less impressive. It was just a piece of paper, no fullcolor printing or anything. And that's my tree service guy.

So, I love what you did, Doug. You tore it out. Who do I talk to about this? How's that working for you? And then the next thing that you said was, you know, Mike's something better.

And I thought to myself, oh my god, I'm going to tell them their baby is ugly. So, how do I do that without telling them that their baby is ugly and they made a bad decision by doing the other one? Have you got any ideas on that? >> Yeah. And it's not even a matter of dissing the current thing.

Just say, um, how's how's it working for you so far? Have you done this before in the past? Are you open to an alternative approach that might generate more business? No guarantees. It might generate more business.

What do you got? Well, here's the card. And if you, you know, put in front of their face and you and you're holding the one that they sent out and you're you're holding them side by side, this looks pretty wimpy. I want a comparison. And it cost them a whole heck of a lot more money than an ad on the 9 by12 would cost.

So, >> you're buried in the gutter on page 42. This is a a cover page, you know, to open it and find it. They're going to look at every single one where they're trying to figure out what coupons to use. So, anyway, I really appreciate the feedback, Ben. Uh, and you know, you're going to be doing great at this because I'm at that point where my initial enthusiasm and fascination with it is kind of worn off.

It's old hat to me. So being able to communicate that enthusiasm like, "Oh my god, this is so new." >> No work. [laughter] >> Really, it was. The first thing didn't seem like work at all.

And as I went around to my tiny town where everybody knows me because I'm in politics, I felt like I was the mayor of the town. Now I'm going to areas that I don't even know the street layouts. Like I use GPS. I'm not cool, you know, where everybody knows my name. >> Well, what I've noted, I'm going to have to book here in a second, too.

But what I've noted is going out the the first card of course was the sample card which had all the mockups of the businesses and all that and you know to people it was still pretty impressive but it's like you know just their makeup businesses but now being able to go out with a card that shows businesses that most people are familiar with in town big difference. Social proof big difference. Even if they didn't get one of those cards in their own mailbox that they're seeing the local bank they're seeing the the card place that they probably drive by every day. huge difference for sure. >> So, I don't know if the post office will let me do this, but I was actually googling this while you were talking a few minutes ago.

Um, I know maybe I have a little bit of a rebellious spirit, but I want to take my once they're done and mail them to everybody that told me no. And [laughter] I just found out you can get a hundred stickers that are two inches by two inches that are like them. Um, I'm going to do the This could have been you, you know, >> and probably probably right over the adisha because that's you everybody looks to see who was it mailed to and if they're looking at themselves, this could have been you. >> That's a good idea. >> Yeah, >> I I mean that because I obviously, as we all do, we talk to a lot of people that that thinking about it or get back to me next month or whatever.

I mean sides, but what I did after the first one went out, I I an email blast out to all those people. Subject line said, "A second chance opportunity." And I basically had a PDF of the card attached to this thing, the one that actually went out, and I just referenced the conversation we had. And I said, "This went out one week ago to 5,000 things." I said, "We had a conversation where you expressed some interest.

I'm putting another one together. Maybe you'd like to have the conversation now." And some people have responded to that. So, and for the people who are signed up for the first one, I sent a similar email out saying a sequel is in the works. I'll tell you what, I'm so sad that um when I went to Sandler, I was up in Indianapolis at Lucian, which apparently is legendary even among Sandler places.

And the idea that iron sharpens iron, just being able to go there for the weekly meetings and um just to other folks like you, Doug, it's it's amazing how many things that you don't think of that somebody else's life experience just instantly brings. >> I I same experience for sure. On that note, I'm going to have to bid you all a great day. Thanks for the opportunity. Hopefully, I didn't dominate things and you got some value out of it, but I do appreciate it and uh to be continued to all of you.

>> Yeah. just used to say that idea of sending to people kind of close to closing but didn't I love that idea. I'm going to do that in some fashion. >> Well, lumpy mail um lumpy work. So, if the post office won't >> uh you know sticker on that because I don't know how that's going to go through the machines.

It's, you know, maximum of a certain thickness and I don't know. I haven't ordered those stickers before. So, at that point, um, I'm going to put it in a custom [clears throat] envelope, which you can get from 3D printers and other direct mail houses that looks FedEx, but it's not FedEx. And it'll say personal and confidential, and it'll be to them, and then, you know, you probably put more stuff in it to make it even a little bit lumpier. >> Um, >> but I'm a I'm one of the nicest people that you've ever met.

I've had 10 kids. I've been married for 36 years. I've got a great reputation in the community, you know, for volunteering and all that. Sometimes when it comes to this competitive sales type stuff, I get personally offended. I shouldn't, but I get personally offended.

Like, what? You didn't like my baby? I know you got the 777 bucks, but you think I'm gonna lie to you. Like, it's not work. And so then I kind of be like, maybe a little bit like how like me now.

[clears throat] >> Oh, I love that. Had a thought and it just went out of my brain. Come back. >> Want another one? >> Yes.

>> Who else has things to say? Oh, I remember what it was now. Here. >> Oh, good. >> Um, so I've been going to post in some these new Facebook groups that I posted for like for like new area and I go in there and yesterday like two before someone else posted with the exact same script I was about to post in with a postcard.

I was like, you're clearly in the group, too. Okay. And they're they're targeting a different area. some like how do I approach this? Cuz you'd have to click, you know, to see that they're doing a different area.

Like I was like, huh, to go about this group a different way. >> Are they in this community? >> Well, the script they pulled was off of a a YouTube video. Like I don't know if it's actually written in in the group. It's from somebody else that does a 9 by12.

happened to watch their YouTube video like two days ago like oh that's the exact video from that other guy or that exact post that that other guy made but I don't think it's actually written anywhere so he did the same thing I did of you know video wrote down everything you know >> best advice if you click on the map in the 9 by12 school you can go to where you're at and see the other people and so you can see if that person is in this group as well >> that's a good idea >> and check our local spotlight Right. And if they haven't grabbed their star, >> hurry up and grab the star. >> But if I'm faced with competition, I'm just going to outwork you. You know, they may just be sending up a test balloon. They may not be serious about this.

So, if you go out and you do uh all the other groups and maybe you change it up a little bit, maybe you don't, but just go in all the other groups and do twice as much posting and work twice as hard and you go get the customers first. But the honest answer is there are so many areas and there's so many different people doing so many different things >> that the chances of us coming across each other even I mean doing this since the early 2000s that I know of and I've known about this for a decade before I ever went out and did any prospecting on it because I had other stuff that I was doing. So just because they sent something out doesn't even mean they're serious. So go take your girl and go take it. >> I love it.

>> Well and the customers can get on both cards, you know, doubles their exposure. >> Yeah. I run into who was I talking to the other day? Oh, my outdoor lights guy that I got. He was the first person.

He jumped all over my post. He's like, "Oh, great. I talked to Rebecca. You uh she was doing this other lady this area a little bit too far north, but you're doing the area I really want. So, that's perfect."

I was like, "Oh, yeah. Yeah, Rebecca. Yeah, she's stuck up a little bit further north. Yeah, she's above her." Yeah.

Yeah. You know, I saw a video where she got interviewed on YouTube a couple I don't know, like ago. I was like, "I actually do know Rebecca. I don't know her personally, but I know exactly who you're talking about. Are y'all doing um any some people do like Facebook where they like their own Facebook group and then they like almost bet of you know different advertisers like reposting and stuff like that.

Have y'all done anything like that? >> I've been thinking about it. I've heard uh I was asking uh Heather Wman about it and she created a Facebook page uh page. Okay. and uh how she does it rather than have to try and moderate comments and whatnot, she does it through her uh Facebook business page.

But Lucy, I guess you've done one. Tell us about that. >> Um well, I'm married to a guy that does digital marketing and all all other kinds of marketing. So, I do have that advantage. So, he set up a Facebook group for us.

It's a local group. Um because I'm so highly charged politically in my area, we made it specifically no political postings. So about the only thing that will turn you down for is political postings, but then we just post the these ad at least once after we publish it. I try to do it twice in a month. You know, it's nice you can get one every day and not overload everybody.

Um but in order to get shouted out again, obviously they have to be on the next card. But um it was a really nice value ad that was totally free for us. I'm surprised at how it's grown. I think I'll go look, but last I checked we had 750 members in a 7,500 person town. So 750 people on Facebook.

Now I got to go make sure that I'm not exaggerating. It may even be more by now. Salem Salem chat my group. It says your group. So I know which one it is.

Nope, that's not it. Salem friends. What did I What did I call this thing? Salem, Indiana friends, families, and neighbors. Okay, there it is.

That also says your group um 791 members. >> I don't know if this is being talked about enough, but many many Facebook groups are ready for a change. The people that started them are old or they have died. you can take over many of these groups, >> you know, you admins and stuff and you end up with it and you can then set your own rules, whatever you want to do. This is a big trend.

I've tried to mention it before, but I don't know how many people, you know, up on it. But if you have local, you know, sort of seems stagnant or something, you know, prime examples that you may be able to take over. >> Also, I have read where sometimes this has happened when somebody has greased the original group's palm with $100. So, you know, these groups have thousands of members already. You know, reinvent the wheel if you can grab on to some of these groups.

And I I know one man that puts this uh out, you know, regular thing. And he's I can tell you how many groups he's taken over in various parts of the country and that. So, it is being done and can be done and you may get it for nothing. You know, toss them a few bucks their way, but you could end up with a captive audience that cost you virtually nothing. >> That's good.

>> You know, take advantage of that. And you can and and you know where you're at and that see how many local groups they are and see what kind of movements are in them, you know, post, you know, a big sign the group really isn't active and might be ready for a takeover, you know. >> Thanks, Frank. >> Yeah. So, I mean, cost you nothing but an email, maybe.

Yeah. Yeah. >> Uh so you need to take advantage of an opportunity like that. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. And what's the worst that can happen?

Anybody want to tell me? >> They can say no. You got to get the nos out of the way before you get the yeses. Everybody remember that? >> Yep.

>> Practice. Practice what makes perfect. If you're not used to public speaking or talking to strange people, practice, practice your phone, practice into the mirror. Go to a graveyard. Those people won't tell you no.

I'm serious. You know, >> talk back to me. So, I'm not going to >> Your spouse, >> you know, practice. You >> had GPT. I did that before my first cold walk-in.

I for an hour I paced them in the parking lot talking back and forth with their voice thing. and that had fake conversations with me. >> Well, good there. That's even modern way. Well, you know, so I haven't caught on to a lot of this, you know, keep get the computer turned on and I have a tech guy on speed dial.

So anyway, >> my best tip that I can give you is go to the 9 by12 group, search out every post that Frank has made because without exaggeration, I think he is the true king of posting and giving good information in our group. I think you put out more quality and more quantity, Frank. So, thank you for that. >> That from a long time of owning businesses and being in sales [clears throat] so on and so forth. You know, a lot of these methods have been around for 50, 60 years.

People forget about them. You know, what worked when cuz they weren't there, you know. Anyway, I I remember a lot of this stuff from then and when the opportunity comes up, I'll chime in on it. So, I'm die hard. You know, tell you this much.

I have recruited and trained over 10,000 salespeople in my various businesses and uh done a tremendous amount of lead generation in olden times, shall we say? you know, um, generation is much different and all of that, but a lot of it still works today, you know, just got to grab on to people's neck and not let go. Practice, practice. You know, get a yes many times until you've asked for it. You know, uh kind of figures from seven to 13 times, you know, can't take one.

No, you got to come back a different way. So on and so forth. But anyway, that's the end of my lecture. >> Hey Frank, I got a question for you. You're in this group, successful business person.

Like you said, you've trained 10,000 people. What is it about the 9 by12, if you had to guess, that most people are missing or were not paying attention to about this opportunity? Like, why is this so good in comparison to all the other stuff that you've done? >> Well, let's face it, the digital world has taken over. postage or postal postcards.

That's old. Okay. But in your mail in most areas, at least once a week, uh you're going to get a postcard from Renewal by Anderson. You're going to get a postcard from Leaf Filter. And in my area, you're going to get a postcard from Spectrum, which is, you know, they all that crap and that.

Hey, why why do they keep doing it? It works. So, the people have gotten tired of a lot of the digital stuff, okay? And this is another way around but get you to the same place. You know another thing that I see and I don't think is talked about enough.

You got to sell these things right. You got to sell on brand exposure and not instant results. You know, another thing that everybody's got to start doing is thinking about longterm selling the packs 3, 6, 9, 12. You know, cash up front. You know, they're giving them the discount.

Don't take deposits. Get all the money. You don't have a sale till you got all the money, >> right? >> You see me preaching that. That's because all of these people that come into this think everybody is telling the truth when they tell you yes.

Well, let me tell you, a lot of times they tell you yes to get rid of you. Had no intention, but they think they're being nice and they think they can avoid you from there on. And many of them do. So, just because you got a yes don't mean anything. You got to have the cash.

get that cash in your hand right away. They say yes, send that link or if you're there in person, you know, a laptop and get their card right then and there or check or cash, whatever, and you got a sale. And why why you have to have the money right then? Can anybody tell me? >> Commitment.

>> Commitment. Remember, exclusivity is an important sales point in this. Okay, you're the only HVAC company that can be on here right now. You know, other end of that is is not only will that rece excuse me, uh, lock in your exclusive spot, but we got to get busy designing this if you haven't already designed one. And of course, that's one of my other things I get on is about mocking up ads before you contact a business.

You can find information about the business. Maybe they got websites, what have you, and all that. Well, how hard is it for you to mock up two ads, a single and a double? >> It's not hard. >> Okay.

Now they go in person or you're doing this, you know, or email, whatever. Okay. How's this? Let me ask you, Mr. Doe of the HVAC company, Mr.

Doe and company, which of these ads do you prefer? Show them both. Shut up. First one that opens her mouth loses. In other words, they got to make a choice.

Either or. If you show them one, well, they could say no. But either or makes it harder for them to say no. And and you start talking again before they talk. You've lost lost.

The either or close puts pressure on them to make the decision and make it harder for them to say no. A lot of times you'll get a double ad that way. If you don't get a double ad, you're more likely to get a single ad rather than a straight no. You know, this is ancient ideas that have been done in sales closing forever. It's been forgotten once again.

So anyway, that's enough of my preaching. >> Yeah. Reminded me when my kids were younger and I ordered the photography package at the mall or whatever, you know, kids in. And obviously there is some expense in printing those those under that paper. But they had my package and then they brought out everything else.

And of course I was young. This is kid number one or two. so I couldn't afford it um to all of the other stuff. But the psychological trick that they tried to use on me was they had pictures of all my kids and when I said no, she put them kind of all together and then held it over the trash can. Nope.

I knew what the psychological trick was. So I could bear to see my children thrown away, which is exactly the [laughter] she was using on me. You don't want to throw your children in the trash. Um but you know here um I wanted but that that eore and actually showing them two different ones and them having to say no to their own images to their own baby that's that's just flat out brilliant. >> Yeah.

Well and easy to do. You just got to learn the trick of it. What's the trick of it >> of it is it's I mean got a different trick. is is you present the two ads, you shut up and you don't talk. That's the most important part of that.

>> That's the hardest part of that. >> Well, you just got to get used to it because people keep talking because they think they're going to talk them into the sale. Don't work that way. I don't care how long you got to sit there. You keep your mouth shut because if you talk first, you definitely are losing.